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edgeworth
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:34 am      Reply with quote

I have a general question about firing weapons. Do they necessarily have to expose your cover? I can imagine that firing at a target in the same room as you would reveal you and arguably from a nearby room (although a case can be made that you would just know where the shot is coming from), but would this also apply for stealth weapons? Silencers aren't in game yet, but what about slingshots and something like crossbows?

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Holmes
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 9:20 am      Reply with quote

You can't hide while firing a gun. Guns are really fucking loud, muzzle flashes are obvious, and it's fairly impossible to retain concealment while still being able to send bullets hurtling at someone.

Crossbows don't exist in the game, and slingshots don't actually do any damage to people so asking "do they have to expose you" is a moot point.


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edgeworth
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:37 am      Reply with quote

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that the WW2 snipers did a rather good job with regard to remaining concealed after firing. I'm certain you would agree that if you were just walking down a street and had a bullet ricochet of the pavement a few metres away from you, aside from being rather startled, you wouldn't know where the shot came from unless you were looking in the marksman's direction to begin with.

My point was more general though: do you plan on keeping it as it is or is it something that will be expanded on with the firearm revamp and, perhaps eventually, silencers?


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Throttle
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:45 am      Reply with quote

There aren't sniper rifles in Rust. More importantly, we really don't want it to be that easy to gun somebody down. It's already easy enough.

Kithrater is planning a redesign of the firearms code when he returns from his trip across the world, but I don't think hidden shooting is part of that. It deals mainly with making firefights more intuitive and less about spam or OOC reactions, as well as making cover more dynamic.


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Drifter
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:49 am      Reply with quote

WW2 snipers generally weren't in the same "room tile" as the people they were shooting.

Keeping hidden from who you're shooting at from 'Very Far Away' would be neat, though it'd need to reveal you to people closer to you, and while I have no code experience, that sounds like an entangled, glitchy mess.


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edgeworth
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 11:25 am      Reply with quote

It doesn't really have to be a "sniper rifle". I'm not sure about other countries, but Russian and German snipers largely used standard rifles. In case of Russians in particular, it was the Mosin-Nagan from somewhere towards the end of the 19th century, though it was modified later to add optics (interestingly enough the most famous Finnish sniper was rumoured not to use any at all). Firing from the same room should arguably reveal you even if you're using the silencer, but a few rooms further away it could act like a regular action while in hiding with all the usual risks of somebody else being in the room with you. (Didn't it work this way in SoI to begin with? I honestly don't remember.)

Not criticising the way it is now. Merely curious about future plans.


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Throttle
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:01 pm      Reply with quote

Quote:
(Didn't it work this way in SoI to begin with? I honestly don't remember.)


Yeah, but they had to change it because people were just single-handedly annihilating whole groups; and that was with bows, which aren't nearly as deadly as guns are here. Between movement time and the search delay, a would-be sniper would be able to take a shot and be three rooms away before the target has even finished the first search in the room the shooter was in. It's a playability thing, we don't want to make it utterly effortless to PK people.


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edgeworth
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 12:05 pm      Reply with quote

Yeah, that does sound like a complete nightmare.

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creepyguyinblack
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The Alpha and the Omega

Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 1:13 pm      Reply with quote

edgeworth wrote:
I have a general question about firing weapons. Do they necessarily have to expose your cover? I can imagine that firing at a target in the same room as you would reveal you and arguably from a nearby room...


I think we're getting hiding and cover mixed up here. Of course shooting a loud gun should break hide, that's obvious. As for cover, I am curious about how it works during a firefight. Do you get removed from cover when firing?


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edgeworth
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Post Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 2:05 pm      Reply with quote

creepyguyinblack wrote:
I think we're getting hiding and cover mixed up here. Of course shooting a loud gun should break hide, that's obvious.


This doesn't relate to PRPI in any shape or form now, but: no, not at all. Knowing the general direction where the noise comes from, even if you catch that much, is in no way equal to suddenly seeing the individual who fired at you or even knowing in general terms where the shot was fired from. Q.E.D. Kennedy was shot at five times from as little as 80 metres. Oswald wasn't immediately apprehended or shot by the finest bodyguards in the United States or any of the present police, but only caught an hour later after shooting some other entirely unrelated policeman.

Sure, cover and being hidden are very much related to each other, thus the "fall on the ground and roll over twice" rule when under fire, but firing a rifle doesn't suddenly expose you to everyone in a mile's radius.


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