Navigation


Home
 
Register a new account  
Log in to view your messages  
Combat Thread
Forum Index   Θ   PRPI Public Development

Reply to Topic Create a Topic
crayon
Registered



Post Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:41 pm      Reply with quote

Sole-wield can spike harder in a single hit. But the difference in ACTUAL DPS is huge. One attack every three-four ticks for 150% damage isn't quite the same as two attacks every two ticks.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Lowdy
Registered



Post Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:47 pm      Reply with quote

Well that would rely on skill right? Someone Familar won't hit as often as someone who is Master, for obvious reasons. If someone with dual wield and sole wield duked it out, wouldn't the 150% reign supreme in the long run? Especially since I have never seen anyone attack more than 2 times in a row while wielding dual weapons. Oh, and does anyone else randomly get spurts of invisible combat too? It doesn't happen all thatoften except when I'm solo fighting something else, but I will see strings of things with no apparent echo but I will notice things like my health lower or my opponents.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
crayon
Registered



Post Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:07 pm      Reply with quote

No.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Lowdy
Registered



Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:04 am      Reply with quote

o.O I know that a general pc can wield a two weapons. A regular sized weapon and a smaller one. The regular, when compared to the large, does less damage. Then the smaller, when compared to the regular, does even less damage than that. So you can hit harder and the large weapon does the most just by base stats. Adding the two handed grip, and you are looking at much more damage. Or am I looking at it wrong?

BTW, I'm not quite sure what you're saying flat out No to.


View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Matt
Registered



Builder

Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:10 am      Reply with quote

No speed has nothing to do with skill level.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Lowdy
Registered



Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:39 am      Reply with quote

.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Lowdy
Registered



Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:52 am      Reply with quote

So, I did all the weapons and greatswords are faster than polearms, but they both do the same damage. Then the next most damage is large bludgeons and regular swords (despite taking four times the metal) But the large bludgeon is somehow faster than the greatsword, regular sword, and polearm. Next comes regular bludgeons and then knives. So it looks like if you want to deal damage, go with swords. IF you want middle man, go bludgeons. If you want fast go knives.

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
japheth
Registered



Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:58 am      Reply with quote

My information on this topic is a little bit old but I am fairly certain the underlying mechanics are still broadly the same as when I last looked at this codebase.

There are really two scenarios that you want to consider: when your opponent is heavily armoured and when your opponent is unarmoured. I don't know PARPI well enough to comment on how heavily armoured most people are but I suspect it's probably similar in numbers values to late period SOI.

The critical mechanic here is that damage from armour is taken off the initial unmodified damage roll. So for instance say you have a dagger/knife (for whatever reason things tended to do their AD&D values of damage - so that's probably about 1d4). Most people could muster at least 4 points of armour, particularly once you take into account weapon vs armour modifiers, so the vast majority of the time the knife will be reduced to 0 damage. When this occurs, there is a 50% chance of it instead doing 1 damage. All other modifiers generally take place after this point.

Why is this important? In many cases the vast majority of weapons end up, on average, being reduced to 0 damage and therefore just doing 1. It doesn't matter how MUCH less than 0 you were reduced to so the extra damage was just wasted. Thus, against a heavily armoured opponent it was always better in DPS terms to dual wield knives, because you'd hit more often and get those 1 damages in more often.

Against unarmoured targets though, the situation was actually slightly different. Because you're not getting damage reduction, your high damage weapons have a chance to shine. Some of the multipliers were HUGE. A critical strike to the neck used to be capable of doing 15x multiplier on damage. Imagine that on a say 12 damage hit from a polearm. I did some pretty extensive empirical testing on this scenario as it wasn't clear intuitively who would be better off, but it turned out to heavily favour the heavy hitting slow weapons. Generally the dwield daggers guys got a few small hits in and then just got chopped in half. It was pretty brutal.

The real life analogue would probably be the difference between a shotgun firing buckshot and a slug. Hit an unarmoured target with that buckshot and it will mess them the hell up, but hit a target wearing a bulletproof vest and you will do diddly - compared to a slug which still probably has a pretty good chance of breaking a bone even through a vest.


View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
crayon
Registered



Post Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:04 pm      Reply with quote

Right.

Flat damage reduction tends to have that sort of effect.

In this case, with weapon damages, a decent strength dual-wielder is probably going to average around twice the DPS of a sole-wielder, assuming both are armored.

Taking armor out of the equation makes things a bit different, but considering that everything in the game has natural armor, and that most PCs are highly geared, it's clearly not a relevant use-case. If you're fighting somebody that doesn't have armor, there's a decent chance you've already won, unless they're significantly higher skilled, just because, you know, they're not armored.


View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Cormac
Administrator



Post Posted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:12 am      Reply with quote

Any recommendations on a system design that would alter that trouble, Jappy?

View user's profile  Send private message  Go to Top
Display posts from previous:   
Page 5 of 9   Θ   Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
Jump to:  
Reply to Topic Create a Topic


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Featured artwork used on Parallel RPI given permission for use by original artists macrebisz and merl1ncz.