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 Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 2:46 pm |  |
Just a few things I've noticed that don't make any sense, or just plain detract from the game, in my opinion.
Gold for bullets:
You realize gold is a very soft metal and would make horrible casings or bullets themselves right?(It is the softest known metal, softer then silver which was proven to be a horrible horrible metal for a bullet) Add into it, I don't see people bringing scraps of gold from anywhere (I could be wrong, I could easilly have missed it in room spam. So the only way I can see getting the gold is to spend a hundred credits on it at the gold place. And it just doesn't make sense. Plus the carats you have listed for some are silly. Six Carat Gold is 6 parts gold 18 parts another metal. Are you attempting to make something like lead for realism? A bullet doesn't need to be soft.
It would make more sense for lower caliber bullets to be like Alion, while the biggest ones need to be made of titan. or whatever. But Gold makes 0 sense for a game like this really, unless you just want to make sure bullets are impossible to get unless you are in a family. I don't think they should be easy, but they shouldn't be this impossibly hard. Earth makes and sells over 1800 tons of gold every year. And Gold isn't formed on earth, it was brought by meteorites that were made when stars exploded. So i stands to reason that gold could be found on the moon naturally, and in scrap (including electronics)
Food:
I get it, you want surviving to be hard. You want food to be scarce. But honestly, this is a bit silly. i went into the sewers with a friend, hunted and killed rats and lizards for a bit over 2 hours, and came out with twenty nine carcass'. Went to breath them, was told zero! Before you get on my case and scream " but there tiny and small! You need a bunch to make a pound!" Let me explain why this is a bit silly. You average non-baby rat weighs something like 500 grams, which is 17 ounces, which is like...1.1 pounds Remove the small amount of skin they have, drop that to about what...1 pound even, maybe .9 of a pound. The lizards are large enough to do some damage to a human (i've seen people come out of fights half dead with one actually) So it's would only serve that they would at LEAST be the size of a 1 pound rat (which isn't that big, i feed them to my snakes every week) It makes more sense to need 20 of them, instead of 40-60.
Learning curve of suicide:
You have a learning curve of committing suicide here. You can go to the sewers and kill lizards all you want. It wont help you the moment a Gato sees and chases you. Period. And they are right outside of the gates. And they WILL chase your ass across the whole moon, until you run out of endurance, and then kill you. I know, i out ran one for a long while, and it followed me until exhausted, even AFTER eating my scaving partner. It still tracked me the fuck down and ate me to.
How about putting an inbetween animal in that spot, and move the gato's more around the ruins ect?
Slums NPCs? Nah, no one actually lives here:
You need more npcs out in your slums. Bums, denzins and muggers. Maybe an npc recruit of whoever's turf it is, walking around with a knife, and maybe another with a pistol or something. Give rival families targets to hit, and it will bring Rp. And add into it, maybe there's an Indie gang springing up? Indies need to be able to rob or extort or whatever the npc's just as families do. Yeah, it's probably dumb as fuck for an indie to go against a family, but according to what little lore you have, it tends to happen in the Red and Niners turf somewhat commonly.
These are a few of my idea's as a new player familiar with other RPI's and ones that have steep learning curves. I hope you realize this isn't a troll, but constructive criticism. I gave my arguements on why I don't think some things make sense, and offered a way to possibly fix them. PRpii can be great, there's so much potential here with gang warfare, ect. You just need to build and fix the base of a game you have here.
Final thoughts:
This game is essentialy atonement, before you put everyone on a ship. So think of it like you are a rust denzin, you scaved up this mostly working piece of nifty. Now you need to clean it up, fix the broken parts, and make it a piece of awesome.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 3:02 pm | |
Don't know about the gold. Somehow, it's used as a substitute for lead in bullets. Don't really care about the feasibility of that. It works in the context of the game to keep stuff scarce. You can scavenge old bullets to put through the gold firebreather, if you want.
Other than that, your comments seem to revolve around it being too hard to play as an independent. Independents are supposed to have it rough.
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Hastur
Registered
#1 Skel
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 3:53 pm | |
Don't breath your meat if you're indie, give a chunk of it to someone for them to butcher it, then cook it on the public grill.
I don't wanna bother doing the math right now, but it ends up being way more food, considering it takes 20 or 30 some odd pounds of organic matter to make a single tub of paste.
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wilde
Administrator
Over Emote-tional
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:08 pm | |
| Mannfreid wrote: |
| Gold for bullets... |
Can't say the gold bullets have ever bothered me much. The carat descriptions all state that the gold is mixed with something else, so that sort of eliminates any softness issues for me.
Sure, there might be other sources of gold on the moon but then to get it would involve much more than just finding old bullets lying about and it's not really worth the effort when this works.
Like Aken said, having them made from something other than our normal metal alloys allows them to stay rare and means people won't have huge stockpiles without having put some considerable amount of work into it.
Hunting isn't the only way to get food. Get creative- talk to people, trade with people. I know for a fact that there are willing, indie-friendly types who will help out in these kind of areas.
| Mannfreid wrote: |
| Learning curve of suicide... |
It is tough outside the gates, yes. But fighting rats and lizards etc isn't the only way to learn- other ways to learn include interacting with other PCs to explore your options, such as being taught and joining big groups to get some experience without getting instantly slaughtered.
I do actually sympathise here though- it is a bit all or nothing and can be frustrating but see above paragraph.
| Mannfreid wrote: |
| Slums NPCs? Nah, no one actually lives here:... |
The slums are full of vNPCs- just because you don't have NPCs walking around, it doesn't mean that they don't exist.
This ties into the turfquest stuff too. See throttle's previous comments on this here.
Yes, it's very tough as an indie, tougher still as a newbie indie. The tough set up of the game should encourage PCs to get together and interact to deal with problems.
I strongly advise people, especially new people, to start off with one of the Families. They take care of a lot of these issues.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:23 pm | |
| Matt wrote: |
Gold- Yes, science. Gravity etc etc. Scarcity.
Food- If you're having such a hard time with food, make friends with a cook. Join a family. (OH NO IT'S TOO HARD TO BE AN INDIE WHICH IS SUPPOSED TO BE REALLY HARD.) Or make deals with whatever skills you have to get food. Going on scav runs and killing and scaving or whatever.
Suicide learning curve- Don't go outside alone or with your buddy, that's just a bad idea. It's supposed to be incredibly difficult to be a solo scav but it's doable, very doable.
Final thought- Make your own game? |
Wow, snarky ass aren't you? I was offering my thoughts on improving the game.
And yes, I understand indie life is supposed to be hard. Out of all this, my suggestions were blown off, and I got one, SINGLE piece of usable actual advice. Bringing my carcass' to a cook. Didn't know that was actually an option, and now I do, and that in itself makes the game a bit more playable.
And yes, I know the slums have VNPC's. But to do much of anything with those, requires staff. And the slums -feel- empty. I was simply making a suggestion to make it feel more like a city, and give people reasons to actually, you know, be there. Which will allow for gang fights, shake downs, and all sorts of other rp.
Final thoughts:
More documentation. Allow people to help file skills before picking them. ESPECIALLY if you want skills like Bio and Chem to have to work together.
You can be snarky and talk shit all you want. But here's the basic undeniable fact: I am a new player, I've played 2 guys. I'm not a noob to MUDS or RPI's. I came here with a few friends to try the game. And we all said the EXACT same things. I am the only one giving the game another shot.
That being said, I'm telling you how we felt. You want to blow me off, or tell me to make my own game. Aint no skin off my back. I'm just trying to help make the game better.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:30 pm | |
| Onasaki wrote: |
Alright, so this guy. This guy, really wants to complain about the lack of realism, the 'shit that don't make sense' as it were.
Lets break it down:
Gold, yes, gold is soft. As someone said it's a substitute for Lead. I say again, yes it's soft, but it's scarce. This is to give the illusion of really NEEDING to find specific amounts of it to make the bullets. Bullets are supposed to be hard to make. Otherwise everyone would be shooting everyone for nothing. And the entire balance of the game would falter.
Food: Food is not hard to get, seriously, I've seen shelves with over 80 food packets. And that's just one 'stack' as it were. Infact, I think food is more EASIER to come by here, then it was on Atonement, but that's besides the point. We're not a survival horror MUD anymore, we're a bustling colony blocked off from the rest of the universe. And when you say you can hunt 30 some lizards and rats in the sewers? This is true, however, to breathe them, you need to skin them, but as someone said before. You don't want to breathe them, it's better to cut them up then cook them. You get more out of it, then just 2 bites.
Slums and NPCs: First of all, you fool, we just opened like three days ago, give the MUD some time to learn to walk before you start shouting about how there's not enough of this, or enough of that. Secondly, there are hundreds of vNPCs, this game is about RP, not murdering stuff for the sake of collecting shiney loots, and hoarding stuff.
And for the record? Atonement Alpha was on a ship before there was Grungetown, piling on the ship in late-release, was part of the storyline.
That said, I would suggest an admin lock this thread because it's clearly an attempt to flame the MUD, and troll it, despite what the OP seems to think is the definition of trolling. Because this isn't 'constructive criticism', it's 'Waah game too hard, me want indie be easy!' |
Again you 100% missed the point of my post I'm not trolling. I'm trying to offer advice on which directions to work on improving. If I was trolling, I'de say the game sucks, and it doesn't. I think it has great potential.
This will be the last time I post any of my thoughts on this forum. Ya'll are asses. Plain and simple. I was offering you my thoughts and how I feel, and you come back as a bunch of trolls.
Don't bother replying, cause I wont read it. Staff might as well lock this thread. It's aparently useless to offer your opinions on how to improve a game that just opened.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:31 pm | |
Come on, these are valid concerns. Just because the rest of us (or many of us) are used to Atonement's Beta and what went on doesn't mean its not a struggle for new people.
The skills could indeed use some helpfiles. A lot of the time they're pretty obscure if you're not familiar with them already.
I would say, though, that things are supposed to be scarce. If you want to coast on the tails of others, I would join one of the clans. They all have intro roles.
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Holmes
Dictator in Absentia
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:50 pm | |
I actually found the post fairly well-toned and reasonable.
I disagree on the unrealistic nature of gold bullets, though, rather profoundly. Bullets -are- supposed to be soft. They're supposed to deform on entry and tear up a person's insides.
The rest of it's worth considering, even if in some cases it's impractical or working as intended.
Gathering food isn't supposed to be easy, especially in the sewers.
People aren't supposed to venture openly into the wilderness without being stealthy or in a
large enough group, etc.
I'd appreciate it if people remained civil, even if you feel like someone is posting things you disagree with.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:54 pm | |
Actually, looking over some stuff online? Gold is actually very reliable in a bullet, but only up to .45 Cal, anything higher it would cause the bullet to break before or after launching from the barrel.
Therefore, you'd get mostly gold buckshot. Which isn't actually too bad.
And yeah, I know Holmes, I was a little harsh, but it doesn't entirely feel like he's being constructive.
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Posted: Sun Jun 09, 2013 5:02 pm | |
Questioning the game's realities shouldn't be met with such hostility. I think the staff should be open to altering things if they make sense or are good for the game's health.
I wouldn't mind there being an alternative to super rare bullets myself, even if they weren't nearly so effective. It would make sense that they'd find something like that over the years.
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